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Friendly matchs...

Verfasst: Mo 15. Sep 2014, 15:28
von papache
Write down here the friendly matchs you have played against another forum (or against a member of JWO). I will integrate the results in the Elo ranking that is currently published on JWO (and that can be published here as well).

The format should be :
(team1 stars1) player1 s1 - s2 player2 (team2 stars2)

For instance :
(China 0.5*) papache 10 - 0 ronaldo (Real 5*)

Re: Friendly matchs Sept 2014

Verfasst: Mi 17. Sep 2014, 07:15
von papache
Come Out And Play !!!

[youtube]8ttWa3Kw7Uo[/youtube]

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Mo 6. Okt 2014, 08:40
von papache
OK, looks like I can recycle this topic for October...

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Do 23. Okt 2014, 07:18
von papache
Yes we could :ymhug: !!!

(Motherwell 0.5*) Papache 1-2 Datschge (Den Haag)
(Willem II 0.5*) Papache 0-0 Datschge (Den Haag)

Both of us are playing with a tight defense, hence with few opportunities for the forwards... On JWO the "0-0" score is named : "papachinade" B-)

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Do 23. Okt 2014, 10:30
von datschge
"papachinade" haha nice :))
We did score some more goals in the first game (1-1 at half time), though the decisive goal was a penalty kick and not from open play... =((
Nice matches! Next time I'll record the stuff. ;)

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Do 23. Okt 2014, 11:57
von papache
Yes, I was unsure about the score of the first match.

"papachinade" is a reference to "papinade", which was used to denote the amazing goals of the great Jean-Pierre Papin (typically a missile from nowhere right in the top corner) :)

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Di 28. Okt 2014, 22:56
von papache
(Motherwell 0.5*) Papache 3-2 Datschge (Den Haag 0.5*)
(Equador 2*) Papache 2-1 Datschge (Den Haag 0.5*)

The draw would have been deserved in the second match.

Looks like I will have have to investigate all the 0.5* teams of the game :) !

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Sa 8. Nov 2014, 23:33
von papache
First pes-up player (almost*) present in the JWO Elo ranking : http://jeux-wii-online.forumgratuit.org ... -pes#46068

( * ) 10 matchs required to be fully integrated in the ranking

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Di 11. Nov 2014, 19:56
von datschge
Nice feature, really like it. Thanks ^^
How do you calculate the stuff? Maybe it's worth to implement that on the server.

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Di 11. Nov 2014, 22:09
von papache
I've adapted the Elo ranking of the chess players : they have only 3 possible results (win/draw/loss), but I have partly taken into account the goal difference.

First for each game between player 1 and player 2, I calculate the "probability of a win" for the player 1 :
p = 1/(1+10^(-(D+200*S)/1000)),
where D is the Elo difference between the two players (D=Elo1-Elo2), and S the stars difference between the team used (S=Stars1-Stars2)

Then I use the math result to determine the "w" variable :
w = 0.00 for a loss of player 1 by 4 goals or more
w = 0.03 for a loss of player 1 by 3 goals
w = 0.10 for a loss of player 1 by 2 goals
w = 0.25 for a loss of player 1 by 1 goal
w = 0.50 for a draw
w = 0.75 for a win of player 1 by 1 goal
w = 0.90 for a win of player 1 by 2 goals
w = 0.97 for a win of player 1 by 3 goals
w = 1.00 for a win of player 1 by 4 goals or more

Last I calculate the number of points earned (or lost if negative) by the player 1 : K*(w-p) (K=25 for a friendly game, K=50 for a tournament game). The player 2 just gets the opposite value.

There are some additional cookings :
- for the new players (less than 10 matchs; others players don't earn/lose points against new players, and these player's points are manually adjusted)
- as this a monthly ranking and not a live one, it requires some damping to avoid huge and unrealistic variations
- a player with less than 1000 points is raised to 1000 points to start the month.

It could be implemented using the server informations, but the players would still have to enter the results (and possibly the stars of the teams)...

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Mi 19. Nov 2014, 22:11
von datschge
(Rayo Vallencano 2*) datschge 3-4 x japan (RCD Espanyol 2*)

Played with playmaker against classic controls, good occasional nice match. But overall still a not so nice play feeling (plenty fouls that usually are called in playmaker are not in such control mismatch, classic control can string together fast blind passing chains from back to goal that defy reality etc. pp.) which is why I usually have different controls turned off when searching for free matches.

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Mi 19. Nov 2014, 22:26
von x japan
Thanks for the game Datschge ! It was a very pleasant one for my side. Are you mad at me because I scored the winning goal during extra time ? ;p
What you say about classic against playmaker is interesting because on JWO, we usually say that playmakers are favored (strict man-to-man defense, cross/header etc.)
I also prefer to play against the same playing style as me. But I find it also interesting to play against playmakers. And otherwise I wouldn't find anyone to play on PES Wii ! ^^

Re: Friendly matchs Oct 2014

Verfasst: Mi 19. Nov 2014, 23:38
von datschge
Well, of course I didn't like the late goal =D , but what I really didn't like (since I'm not used to) is the different feel against classic control. I'm sure you at JWO are more used to matches between different controls. Here in this community we used to essentially keep both controls strictly separate, and at some point no classic player was left. It's pretty clear that the different controls demand different sets of skills from the player. I'm used to play through pressing and positioning, not allowing the opponent to advance. Classic control with its finer control over ball handling and faster more decisive passing (and much different AI movements) makes me much more dependent on 1vs1 cases than usual, and if even those are pushovers with no calls from the referee I do feel a little cheated. Now of course I could change my playing style to better exploit the weaknesses of classic controls, but that normally just isn't something I do. B-)

Maybe that'll change if we play more often against each other. :ymsmug:

Re: Friendly matchs Oct-Dec 2014

Verfasst: Do 20. Nov 2014, 10:07
von papache
Indeed your point of view is interesting, Datschge, because it is completely different from the ones that we generally had on JWO.

We have always mixed classic and playmaker players on JWO, and the ones who were sometimes complaining about that were... the classic players (some of them, not all of them).

The general consensus was that the playmaker style was giving an advantage over the classic style : more freedom to move the field players, more control on the passes/crosses... so at the end a lower dependance on the IA. Of course, the classic style also has some exclusive stuff (e.g. ball handling), but overall the playmaker has the edge. And this is actually supported by our stats :

We have maintained the Elo ranking for 30 months during the CWF era, and this is summarised here : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc ... d=2#gid=57 . Classic players have a star beside their names. 53 different players have been ranked at a moment or another : 31 playmaker (58%), 22 classic (42%).
4 players reached at least 1800 points : 3 playmakers (75%), 1 classic (25%)
15 players reached between 1500 and 1799 points : 10 playmakers (67%), 5 classic (33%)
18 players reached between 1200 and 1499 points : 11 playmakers (61%), 7 classic (39%)
16 players reached less than 1200 points : 6 playmakers (38%), 10 classic (62%)

Clearly the percentage of classic players decreases when going towards the higher number of points. The average number of points of the playmaker's is 1410, the average number of points of the classic's is 1316.

Even more demonstrative : the 23 league seasons that happened on JWO during the CWF era are summarized here : http://jeux-wii-online.forumgratuit.org ... e-palmares . Over the 69 top 3 positions that result from the 23 leagues, one can find only 8 times a classic player (I estimate that the percentage of classic players in the leagues was roughly one third).

Definitely, my conclusion is : the playmaker style gives an advantage.

Re: Friendly matchs Oct-Dec 2014

Verfasst: Mo 24. Nov 2014, 23:17
von papache
(OM 4*) Papache 1-1 KamahI (Shalke 04)
(Arsenal 4.5*) Papache 1-1 KamahI (Tottenham 4.5*)
(Sainté 3.5*) Papache 3-2 KamahI (Lille 3.5*)

KamahI is back :) !

Re: Friendly matchs Oct-Dec 2014

Verfasst: Do 4. Dez 2014, 21:58
von papache
November 2014 games :

Bild

Re: Friendly matchs Oct-Dec 2014

Verfasst: Do 4. Dez 2014, 22:56
von papache
papache hat geschrieben:Definitely, my conclusion is : the playmaker style gives an advantage.
That said it's also a matter of personal style and preferences. All players have different playing styles, and independently from the skill, a specific styles may or may not fit our own style. On JWO, Jab and Julien (both playmaker) were overall equally strong, but I could much more often get "good" results against Jab than against Julien, because they were playing with different styles, and the one of Jab was more appropriate to me.

Since playmaker or classic controls result in specific styles, it can be that you don't feel good with the typical classic styles. It was the case for MathieuPES : he was by far the best JWO player, but he had often difficulties against the classic players. But some other players play equally well against classic or playmaker styles.

And finally it is also (and simply) a matter of skill : XJapan definitely got very good at playing PES. His very agressive pressing + heavy offside strategy + Neuer-like goalkeeping, can be a nightmare for its opponents...

Re: Friendly matchs (january 2015)...

Verfasst: Sa 3. Jan 2015, 15:48
von papache
(Zenit 3.5*) Papache 2 - 1 KamahI (Braga 3.5*)